Vogue 8940 Trousers: The Muslin

Sunday, I traced out the trouser pattern from Vogue 8940 and made a muslin, and I’m back to report my first attempts at fitting them.

Pattern Details

Vogue 8940 is a contemporary styled, tapered trouser pattern.  Some things I noticed about it:

  • It has slant pockets in front. In back it does not have welt pockets, as I first guessed. The rear pockets are on-seam pockets, using the yoke seam. The rear pockets are covered with flaps.
  • Unlike the Jedediah pants, V8940 has a contoured waistband with overlap and underlap extensions across center front.
  • The pattern comes in two multisize editions: 34-36-38-40, and 40-42-44-46. I have both editions, so all bases are covered.

Constructing the Muslin

Following the instructions on Vogue’s website, I chose the size corresponding to my waist measurement – 36, according to my tape measure. I traced out front, back, yoke, front pocket facing, and waistband pieces. Then I cut out the muslin.

Following the advice in Roberto Cabrera’s book Classical Tailoring Techniques: Men’s Wear, I added a zipper and a waistband for the fitting. It was good to get that question settled, because I have heard and read conflicting advice from fitting experts as to whether a waistband is desirable for a fitting muslin. Peggy Sagers says you don’t need the waistband and it gets in the way; Joyce Murphy says it is essential so you can properly judge how the pants hang.

Also following advice from another pants fitting article in Threads, I drew grainline, crotch, hip and knee lines onto the muslin as guides to judge how the garment hangs.

After going through all that effort, I was rewarded with a pair of pants I couldn’t put on.  The waist was three inches too short, and there was no ease at all along the hipline.

Measuring the Pattern

So I did what I should have done from the start: took a tape measure to the pattern and directly measure the pattern sizes.

Waist

I measured the size 36 muslin I prepared, then used the tape measure to measure the waistband for the other pattern sizes.

Pattern Size Muslin measure WAISTBAND measure
36 32.5″ 33″
38 35″
40 37″

My current waist size, 36″, falls right between the 38 and 40 pattern sizes.

I also measured the pair of Levi 501 jeans I was wearing. The jeans, advertised as a size 33 waist, actually measure 36.5 inches and fit me well. Vanity sizing in action.

Hip

Following the instructions in Nancy Zieman’s Pattern Fitting With Confidence, I measured the pattern at the hip and compared with Vogue’s finished hip measurements printed on the pattern tissue.

My measurements consistently came out 2 inches more than Vogue. But I think Vogue might be more accurate, as I have a 39-inch hip measurement and I just fit into the size 36 pants.

Pattern Size MY Measurement Vogue’s Measurement
36 41″ 39″
38 43″ 41″
40 45″ 43″

Either the size 38 or size 40 patterns could possibly work.

Unsure of how much ease I wanted in the hip area, I consulted Don McCunn’s book How To Make Sewing Patterns and found this table for recommended hip ease:

Tight Snug Comfortable
Women 1″ 2″ 3″
Men 1″ 2-3″ 4″

I also measured the hip, as best I could, on two pairs of Levi’s pants in my closet. Docker Alphas are Levi’s slim and tapered take on their traditional Docker pants.  The City Khakis are a very similar silhouette.

Pant Hip Size
Docker Alpha 43″
Docker City Khaki 43 1/2″

Considering that it’s easier to pin-fit a slightly oversized muslin, all signs pointed towards size 40.

The Muslin

Here’s what the size 40 muslin looks like, straight out of the envelope, no alterations.  I did pin up the legs at the knee so the hem would break nicely.

IMG_1701

IMG_1703

IMG_1706

IMG_1708

IMG_1689 IMG_1690

Already it looks better than the Jedediah Pants pattern; it can even pass ready-to-wear fit standards for a lot of people.

I thought there might be too much ease in the hips, but sitting takes up all that ease and I’m glad it’s there.

The problems I’m noticing with the muslin are:

  • Wrinkles under the seat from excess fabric.
  • Fullness in the back, vertical drag lines along the thighs.

Seat Wrinkles

The wrinkles under the seat seem to be a recurring theme with me. Previously, one of my readers suggested, “It’s not you, it’s the pattern”. Perhaps it is me, after all.

I consulted the many fit references I had on hand for the best match for the problem and advice for solving it.

Pants for Real People

I don’t want to turn this into a review of Pants for Real People, except to say this book gets on my nerves for the same reasons its companion volume Fit for Real People does: it’s insistence on tissue-fitting as part of its “secret sauce”, and its heavy emphasis on plus-sized women as the definition of “real” people. Also, roughly half the book deals with pants construction, not fitting, which I feel is a bit of a ripoff.

But I was pleased to discover that PFRP devotes three whole pages to pants for men, half of that actually devoted to fitting.  Here’s what it had to say:

pfrp_1 pfrp_2

 

I hope I haven’t broken any fair use laws; this is close to the extent of the fitting coverage for men in the book.

Fabulous Fit

Fabulous Fit, by Judith A. Rasband and Elizabeth L.G. Liechty, offered a similar diagnosis:

fab_fit

It also prescribed deepening the crotch curve, pointing out that this alteration is one of the few that can be done with ready-to-wear as it simply involves stitching a deeper curve below the original.

Here’s the thing, though: I don’t really have a flat butt.  Yes, I’m over 40, and I’m sure my butt was rounder at age 25, but I don’t think I yet quality for the flat-butt club.

Trouser Draft

Kenneth D. King’s ebook Trouser Draft has an extensive section on fitting, using King’s own fitting methodology. Here’s King’s take on my issue:

kking_trouser

And there’s a big insight: my hips/seat have always been a little large in relation to my thighs.

Finally, it’s worth noting that some readers (Laura and Shari) suggested a flat-butt adjustment back in the first article of this pants fitting series.  It just took a while for me to realize it too.

Fixing the Seat Wrinkles

I decided to follow the advice in PFRP and Fabulous Fit by stitching a new, deeper crotch curve in back.

First I tried deepening the curve about 3/8 inch, tracing out a curve formed by matching a flexible ruler to my body.  I marked it in yellow and just stitched over it on the machine.

IMG_1722And here’s the result.

IMG_1718 IMG_1719A little bit better, but not that much of a difference.

So I deepened the curve even more.

IMG_1733

I think this change has made a noticeable improvement.  On the photos below, I also took in the right side seam both front and back by about 1/2 inch from the hip to knee, removing about 1 inch of ease in total.  This was to try to eliminate some of the vertical drag lines along the back thigh.

IMG_1723 IMG_1731 IMG_1724

 

So What Now?

Right now, I’m trying to decide if I should try more modifications before proceeding to an actual garment. The muslin is actually quite stiff and not as drapey as some fashion fabrics, so I’m curious how this will look as an actual garment.

Also, removing the excess along the side seams also makes the legs look straighter, so I’m mulling if I like that style choice.  (Though it just occurs to me I could remove the excess along the side via pivot/slide, and reduce circumference while retaining the style lines of the original pattern).  I could also consider taking a vertical tuck along the back as suggested by PFRP, but I really don’t want to mess with the pattern above the hipline.

Overall, though, Vogue 8940 seems like a nicely drafted pattern that looks like a viable path to a decent fitting pair of pants.

About Cloning

Several readers suggested I clone a garment.  I took some photos of myself in the Levi Docker Alpha City Khakis – the garment I had considered for doing a rub-off.

IMG_1709 IMG_1711 IMG_1714 IMG_1715

Ugh.  I thought I actually looked reasonably good in these pants. The V8940 muslin looks better than these pants do.  If I’m going to do a rub-off, I’m going to have to look for pants that fit better than these Levis.

Next Time

Maybe an actual test pair?  We’ll see.  As always, I value and appreciate your comments.

 

 

30 thoughts on “Vogue 8940 Trousers: The Muslin

  1. Corey

    i got to say this out loud

    none of these patterns are working for you .. your not a model .. you have some body issues and i am being kind … make your pattern draft from your pants that fit you ….

    you are not built to be a runway model and perfect pants from commercial patterns ..not
    i apologize if i am being unkind but man .. look at those pants on you .. hideous
    .. your shape is hard to fit .. waist going everywhere outwards .. you have no butt .. white woman pancake butt .. you don’t event have a butt .. i don’t even know where you hips begin or start .. just face up .. no pattern is going to work for you

    your body .. tailor custom trousers or make a knock of pants that fit you

    I DEEPLY APOLOGIZE FOR BEING BLUNT .. AND IF YOU THINK NASTY .. but man nothing fits you
    again i totally apologize for being rude .. and up front .. nothing is working for you

    Reply
      1. Stoting Stitch

        mportuesisf:

        Yours was an exceptionally gracious response. If I ever do a blog, I will use it as a model. I’ve considered writing a blog primarily to keep myself accountable in regard to sewing, but have hesitated in part because I’m extremely thin-skinned. Yet I think it’s important to permit frank, relevant comment, and too many sewing blog comment sections are gushing, mutual admiration societies. But in my case a photo of the garment on the dress form will have to suffice. :-)

        Even when other sewers do things differently than I would I appreciate that they are putting themselves out there.

        Good luck with your trousers.

        Reply
    1. Stoting Stitch

      Corey:

      Comments like yours are the reason I shall never, ever post muslin photos of myself, even in the precincts of Cutter and Tailor, where the professionals are 100% more diplomatic. LMAO.

      Having said that, I agree with most of your points, although I think this starting muslin looks much better than that for the Jedediah pants.

      Reply
    2. gilbert gripe

      I really hate that so many of the fitting books practice victim blaming I.e. The pattern is perfect, the problem is your body.

      The set up is always how to accomodate your too large tush, or your “sway back”. It makes more sense when you state the problem as, “What is wrong with the pattern?” Then the solution presents itself e.g. the back crotch length on the pattern is too short etc.

      Reply
  2. Susan Campbell

    Wow, your posts are nothing if not thorough. I know what you mean about thinking pants fit well, until you really see them in photos. But still it’s a place to start. I enjoy following your progress. I used my best fitting pants to help me figure how to make a pattern that fit decently. So far so good.

    Keep up the good work.

    Sue C

    Reply
  3. John Yingling

    Me again…the Vogue pattern, once you figured out your size, is a much better start, and something I think you can get to work for you. Working with the first muslin, I would first pinch out any excess at the side seam from the waist to hip to mid thigh, to eliminate fullness at the hip. The fullness beneath the buttocks can be removed first with a vertical tuck from just below the fullest part of the butt to somewhere above mid thigh. You then transfer that dart to the inseam of the inner thigh back seam, and little to the back rise/ crotch seam. I think those alterations will smooth out the fullness below the derrière. You should use an assistant to get the sides and back darted, since it’s hard to do it on yourself.

    As for copying an existing pair of pants, how about visiting the local thrift store that has lots of men’s pants, and try on every pair until you find the best fit?

    Reply
  4. peterle

    Fitting pants, especially tight pants, is a very difficult thing, even for a professional.
    And a paper pattern is always only a starting point, no matter wether it is a commercial one or a self drafted one.
    I think the new pattern is quite good for you and works for . the trousers are hanging nearly without any folds or drags. it is balanced and the seams are hanging straight.
    But i think the pants are a bit too wide at the horizontal seat line.(the lower blue line)
    You could try the following:
    to keep the balance of the pants you have to remove the excess wideness distributed evenly to top and underpants.
    Easiest mehod is to cut both paper pattern pieces along the middle lines from hem to waistline and across from side seam to inner seam along the seat line (lower blue line). dont cut the paper completely, keep a little bit attached at the contour lines as pivot points. Now you can remove the desired amount of wideness by overlapping the halves along the middle line. the halves should overlap 1 inch max at the seat line, pivoting at hem and waist line.
    doing this will create a diamond shaped opening at the seat line. Now you only have to restraigthen the hemline and waistline by removing the little bulge that formed at the pivot points.

    another tip: the tighter a pant should be the more you have to stretch the curve of the seat seam with an iron before you sew it. this length is required to form a nice butt.

    Reply
  5. Mainelydad

    I’m in awe of all of this! I’m just not that much of a perfectionist, so I would have said “umm, good enough” long ago. It’s not that I don’t want things to look as good as possible, but at the end of the day I want clothes that are comfortable and that I can move in. You make me feel so lazy! Soldier on. I look forward to seeing how things turn out.

    Reply
  6. Wil

    Actually, I think the muslin looks good. The pants look better on you than the model used by Vogue. The little adjustment you made is getting the fit close to perfection. Thank you for condensing your research to an easily understood format.

    Reply
  7. Lillian

    A couple of years ago I made 9 (nine) muslins before I began to think I might be able to wear pants made by me. Now I am working on three more tests as I learn more. One thing that came out of the many muslins was not just deepening the crotch, but changing the shape as well – my “curve” is more like a right angle now. Granted my shape is way different from yours, but fitting by myself took a loooong time just to be able to “see” my real shape. A kind but honest fitting buddy would be nice.
    Keep going. It’s fascinating.
    Lillian

    Reply
  8. Shari

    I think this Vogue trouser muslin looks better than the Jedediah muslin and rtw pants. I was in denial that I needed to do a drooped butt adjustment for my own pants but the flexible ruler does not lie and I’m over 50, although in decent shape. That adjustment worked well for me, easier than thousands of squats! One thing I have found is that muslin shows every flaw because of its lighter color. Perhaps try a muslin in a darker fabric next time. I think you’re making progress overall considering how challenging pant fitting can be.

    Reply
    1. Stoting Stitch

      Kathleen Fasanella of Fashion Incubator recommends using regular muslin or fabric in a light color precisely because it shows every flaw. It’s the best way to see what the problems are.

      Reply
      1. John Yingling

        I like using white or natural muslin fabrics so I can mark changes and alterations with either my Sharpie or my magic purple pen. I asked one of my clients who was going to do lots of Superman-type Lycra suits/unitards, that he needed to order a full roll of white or natural cotton-Lycra for muslining up our designs. His Korean accent is thick, and I’m sure the Middle Eastern guy he ordered from didn’t understand him, so a week later I get 25 yards of chocolate brown for muslins. Great! I have to use my triangle tailor’s chalk with it’s 1/4″ wide lines for marking, such precision!

        Reply
        1. Stoting Stitch

          John Yingling:

          That’s funny about your client. Of course, as you note, the other reason for using light-colored material is to be able to mark it up and easily see the notations. I add the grainlines on both sides (so I can put on the muslin with the SAs on the inside and see the grainline) and the date and time, at minimum. A colored marker or chalk is the method I’ve used for marking the pin fitting changes.

          Susan Campbell:

          If you can’t see and don’t fix the major flaws, it won’t look good. The muslin does not lie. There’s no point in sewing up something that looks like crummy RTW — you can go to the store and buy that for a fraction of the price and in much less time.

          Reply
      2. Shari

        I don’t wear light colored pants generally so light colored muslins don’t make sense for me unless I want to be in a endless cycle of muslin making. I’m a perfectionist at heart so all those flaws bug me. I recently made a long skirt and it was so wonderful to have it fit right out of the envelope. But I live in the upper midwest where skirts (or light colored pants) aren’t real practical in winter.

        Reply
  9. Tina Olsson

    Hello Michael!
    I really enjoy following this adventure! You are pretty close to perfect pants now!
    As a men’s tailor I have a few ideas that cold maybe improve your pants further. Sorry it became a lengthy one…

    But first, I can tell you are beginning to “see” clothes and fabric in the right way for good fitter and once you see, you cannot “unsee”.
    This is why you suddenly find that your favorite pants no longer look the way they used to ;)

    As I see it, you have two problems with fitting your pants. Number one is a classic, and tricky, tailoring problem, but number two is easier.

    First, problem no 2!
    Now, no one is “perfect” (certainly not supermodels either ) and to be different from the standard is very much the normal thing.
    I borrowed the photo of you in your Levi’s and traced some “boxes” on it to represent the position of your body parts. (It cannot be put in a comment I notice, so it’s on my pinterest board http://www.pinterest.com/pin/384002305702850819/, I REALLY, REALLY hope you don’t mind???)

    As you can see, your hip is angled up a tiny bit in the front, and your legs are angled back in the knees. Simply put, you’re curvy! This is neither unusual nor strange, but it is giving extra problems to pant fitting, as pant legs are usually straight tubes of fabric. Problem no 2 mentioned above is your calves pulling the whole pant leg back, and causing big wrinkles along all the leg, plus giving the impression of broader hips and skinnier legs than than you actually have. Look at the photo of yourself facing the camera, wearing your Levi’s.

    You see it, right? So, the legs of your pants need extra fabric added on the backside of the lower leg. Add to the side seam on both sides of the back leg, you need to experiment with the amount and the shape. For example, a dart can be put in from the bottom of the back leg to mid-calf, to add width. But this will only fix it so far, as you see I have written add and remove all over the legs, but there is no natural way of doing that in an ordinary pattern, it would require seams up and down along center font and back, or across, or lots of darts (not the look you’re after, right?) but keep it in mind when you make patterns as this is the natural shape of your body, not likely to change. For example, there will always be a risk of too much fabric under your seat.

    So, over to classic problem, or number one, the wrinkles under your seat. So far I think you have made a great job, I just want to point out what will happen if you take it further.
    If you would like to remove more of that fabric, you can imagine it by grabbing the top of your center back seam and lift the whole pant as high as you can, while wearing them. This will certainly remove the wrinkles, but also be very uncomfortable. If you would translate that feeling to the pattern it would mean removing a lot along the waist and scooping out the crotch seam quite much more. But that lift would also drag the front part of your pants in between your legs, which will tell you that you also need to lengthen the crotch seam by adding on to the inner seams quite a lot, plus probably correcting all this by removing width from the side seam. Basically you get a whole different pattern.

    If you do this, you are on your way to create a “straight back pant design” (And I have added a quick drawing of this on my pinterest too http://www.pinterest.com/pin/384002305702850862/). It shows the two versions on top of each other, identical below the knee but the top halves are very different. These are two extremes in back pant design, the “straight” and the “curved” (probably NOT the correct terms in english tailoring) The curved one is roomy and comfortable, and the straight one elegant, classy and supremely UN-comfortable!

    In the straight back pant you will find the that the back side pulls on the knee with every step you take, you will get big wrinkles bunching up in front when you sit down, and you will always have a big, drafty gap between the hem of your pants and your socks when you sit down. All of this because the back is essentially too short to allow the body normal movement.

    Basically, i think you have reached a very good point in between, considering your body shape.
    But I think you could try lengthening the crotch seam a fraction, by adding to the top of the inside seam, and taper it to maybe 1 inch down.
    The slightly tilted hip pulls the backside of your pants a bit forward between the legs, so this change is supposed to happen between the legs only and not change the overall shape of the seat. You can also try scooping out a bit more of the back and front crotch seam, putting it a bit lower in general. This will probably give your pants a less modern look, but modern isn’t always what fits best…..

    Hope this is giving you some ideas to try in your future muslins!
    Good luck!
    Tina

    Reply
    1. mportuesisf Post author

      Tina,

      A big, big thank you for jumping in here and taking some time to offer your advice. There’s a lot here for me to take in, but I just wanted to let you know I’m perfectly okay with your taking photos off this blog to markup and post on Pinterest.

      Reply
    2. gilbert gripe

      This is good stuff. I have a question regarding the first photo. Because human legs aren’t actually tubes, but curve in this plane, how can we remove length from under the bum? This seems to be a perennial problem.

      In jeans I’ve thought about adding a back yoke and taking a curved slice of fabric out at the yoke seam. No length change at center seam and outside seam, but length removed mid cheek.

      Reply
  10. Susan Campbell

    I guess it depends on if you want to see every possible flaw or whether you want to see how good it can look. LOL

    Sue C

    Reply
  11. Randy

    Wow, thanks for all the detail here, and to the commenters too. I was going down a similar road this past summer. I will be revisiting this when I get back into pants again.

    Thanks for turning me on to Peggy Sagers, I have watched a lot of her webcasts, there are some very valuable nuggets of information there. The concept of circumference vs. length vs. depth is very helpful to wrap your mind around.

    I agree that you are close to perfect on these and better than the model on the envelope, certainly better than the Jed which for some reason has always looked weird to me, I don’t like proportionally where the yoke line divides the butt.

    Anyway, thanks for the inspiration!
    Randy

    Reply
    1. mportuesisf Post author

      Randy,

      Thanks for writing – I’m glad if my experience is helping you sort out your fitting issues too. I agree that Peggy Sagers is a great find. A reader found another YouTube episode of Fit 2 Stitch dealing with pants fitting, from the first season of the show – check out the comments in the other posts here on the blog.

      The concept of length vs. circumference vs. depth that Peggy Sagers teaches is both powerful, and understandable. I rank it up there with Kenneth D. King’s “Smart Fitting” methodology in terms of conceptual ways to help you think through a fitting problem. King’s “Trouser Draft” ebook explains it in detail as it applies to pants, and he wrote a series of articles in Threads magazine that cover the concept in general – let me know if you want the biblio entries to point to them.

      Finally, at the suggestion of David Coffin, I’m working through Sarah Veblen’s pants fitting course at PatternReview.com. It is on sale at the moment. I’m about half-way through it and so far I’m giving it a thumbs-up.

      Reply
  12. gilbert gripe

    I have been trying to crack the pants fitting nut for a few years now. I’m now to the point that I draft from scratch. What I’ve figured out.

    1. Center of knee needs to line up with center of thigh at crotch level. Women’s patterns will offset the knee by one inch on the back pant pattern. This always gives me a half inch deep fold from hip to knee on the outside seam.

    2. Take all measurements front and back, horizontal and vertical. The pattern has to be drafted for those measurements plus ease.

    3. Start by putting a belt on your body where you want the waistband to be. The first decision is deciding what rise looks good on you. Try to find the sweet spot. People with long torsos or short legs might want a higher rise. When you sit the waistband pulls down in the back and up in the front, so I like to make the waistband higher in the back than the front. Also decide where you want the side seams to fall. You need to make a decision because all of your measurements will have a front and a back.

    4. The difference between jeans, slacks and trousers is how much ease is under the bum, I.e. horizontal ease at the crotch level. I’m a woman. I use 1.5 inches for jeans and 2.25 inches for slacks, 3″ for loose trousers. My husband’s rtw chinos from land’s end I can pinch like 5 inches of ease under his bum. Men don’t look dumb with lots of ease.

    At the waist I use 0″ of ease. At the hip I use 2.5 inches for jeans, 3″ for pants and trousers. At the knee I always use more ease than at crotch level so I don’t get jodpurs. At least 1/2 ” more. So 2″ on jeans.

    I don’t add ease to crotch lengths, When I’m measuring I hold the tape the way I want it to fit. I don’t have “junk”. I’m guessing you want your crotch to hang lower and looser than women wear their pants.

    5. Tie an elastic around the hip, and around one leg at the crotch level. On women’s pants pattern the vertical distance from hip level to crotch level is 2″ on the front and 2.5″ on the back pattern. What is it on men’s patterns? More to accomodate the “junk”? Back inseam is usually 1/2 inch shorter than front inseam, hence the 1/2 inch difference.

    6. Measurements: Front and back waist. Front and back hip. Front and back crotch length. Thigh girth at crotch level, front and back. Knee girth (measure at the lump above the knee) Side length from waist to hip, waist to crotch level, waist to hem. In seam distance from crotch to knee.

    I compare my measurements to the pattern and they are nothing alike. In the beginning I would correct the widths and lengths using the slide and pivot techniques of Nancy zieman books. Now I draft from scratch.

    I have found out that crotch shape isn’t so critical, straight lines from waist to hip, and then I use a curve with largest body space that gets me from hip level to crotch point. The back crotch shape on your pattern looks awful. Much to “L” shaped, It’s like they tried to get more crotch length without using more fabric.

    Does any of this help?

    Reply
    1. gilbert gripe

      Thought about the L shaped back crotch curve. That could be fine if you wanted lots of below bum fullness, like zoot suit pants, but it’s not good if you pull all the fullness out by taking the pants in at the outside seam.

      Reply
    2. mportuesisf Post author

      I’m currently studying the Pattern Review pants fitting class from Sarah Veblen, and I’m finding it very helpful.

      One thing I have picked up from the class is that the crotch curve is the most important thing to get adjusted early on in the fitting process, before moving on to other areas. The methods she presents in her class make sense to me, and I’m in the process of trying them out.

      But another idea that works well is to use a flexible ruler to mold out the actual shape of my crotch curve. I’ve used this to help “scoop” out the back crotch seam to better match my actual body shape, and yes the curve records the extra room necessary to accomodate the male “junk”, as it were.

      I do like Nancy Zieman’s pivot and slide techniques and you’ll see me use them a lot on this blog. I think they’re useful for doing length and circumference alterations, and they work well for that purpose. I think pivot and slide is good for your first round of alterations to get you in the ballpark.

      But my current thoughts are that in order to really get the fit right, you actually have to do a trial muslin, adjust the garment on the body, and take those alterations back to the pattern. There’s nothing in Nancy Zieman’s book that covers the kind of crotch fitting and adjustments covered in Sarah Veblen’s class.

      I’ve got a set of alterations planned out from my fitting, just waiting for time to work on a new muslin.

      Reply
  13. Lulu

    I think you are very close to achieving a nice fit with the Vogue pattern. I do think you should try a slight adjustment for low/flat derriere – what it will do is remove some of the excess fabric length that is pooling at and just below your bum (and straighten the grainline vertically as well). After that, you may find you also want to take out some fabric width around the thighs (at the inseam and/or side seam, depending how maintaining the vertical grainline).

    Since you are in the Bay Area, I highly recommend Linda Maynard’s fitting and pants sloper classes. She teaches at CCSF and Canada, and is extremely knowledgeable, and a wonderful teacher. The hands-on practice fitting a variety of body types/issues is invaluable, even bodies shaped differently from one’s own will help you identify the fit issues and fixes for oneself.

    Reply
    1. mportuesisf Post author

      Thanks for the feedback.

      I tried scooping out the crotch considerably more than shown in this article, and made a muslin around it, which wasn’t successful. I’m going back to the fit I’ve identified here. One thing I did notice was by raising the crotch height (rise) a half-inch, it felt more comfortable to me.

      I’ll consider the low derriere adjustment.

      I’m taking the Sarah Veblen pants fitting course online from PatternReview.com, which is a tremendous help. Thanks for the tip on Linda Maynard – I’ll look her up.

      Reply
  14. Dale Webdale

    Just a note on picking pattern size. When Vogue suggested using your waist size , they did not mean to use your waist measurement as the pattern size. Each pattern size has a corresponding set of body measurements. If you look at the size charts you will see that a 36″ waist corresponds to a size 42. Looks like the 42 may have been too big, but it would have been a better start. BTW, I always measure pattern pieces; errors in patterns are not uncommon.

    Of all of your references, my recommendation is to stick with Joyce Murphy. You may want to contact her for help.

    Best of luck

    Reply
    1. mportuesisf Post author

      Dale,

      Thanks for the clarification on the Vogue size charts; that clears up a mystery for me. In the end, matching my hip measurement versus the finished garment size on the pattern worked for me. I’ll always measure the pattern in the future.

      I agree that Joyce Murphy knows her stuff; I went through all the articles on pants fitting in Threads and hers were the ones that really made sense to me and were insightful.

      I’m taking Sarah Veblen’s pants fitting course via PatternReview.com and finding it to be even more valuable than Joyce Murphy, and I can ask Sarah questions via the class forum. She only answers general questions via the class forum, but you can purchase online private consulting sessions via her website for a pretty reasonable fee. I might consider doing that if I get really stuck.

      Reply

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